From mint-bounce@lists.fishpool.fi Thu Jul 7 05:21:30 2005 X-Original-To: fnaumann@mail.boerde.de Delivered-To: fnaumann@mail.boerde.de DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=cr+y0FNQLMviwEaSn3d5y86cpTaC7jHBIBV19ZWxecQoGyz/Jn3yDkCWwEpQ54/wBsrecHd2IEw97GUCsE6IA7AT/DWuUNQTdSXSVsvxyghDi2PAFH6trGRLRrVrgD0askas1ilSTNuIPS2Nak9JFy3nE3ezYdF+lHfqpVayEfU= ; Message-ID: <20050707031836.50604.qmail@web31011.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Date: Wed, 6 Jul 2005 20:18:36 -0700 (PDT) From: Frederic Fouche Subject: Re: [MiNT] Cool new AES features To: MiNT List In-Reply-To: <1120701844.5673.87.camel@linuxbox> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0-1685815843-1120706316=:50240" X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: mint-bounce@lists.fishpool.fi Errors-To: mint-bounce@lists.fishpool.fi X-original-sender: x130844@yahoo.com Precedence: bulk List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-Id: X-List-ID: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at relay.boerde.de X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on relay.boerde.de X-Spam-Status: No, hits=6.1 tagged_above=-50.5 required=7.0 tests=AWL, BAYES_00, FORGED_YAHOO_RCVD, FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS, FROM_WEBMAIL_END_NUMS6, HTML_MESSAGE X-Spam-Level: ****** --0-1685815843-1120706316=:50240 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I've been reading quietly this whole thread. =20 It's a little confusing, and I understand the frustration of some people. =20 My take is: find something that works well (be it zview modules, or whatever),=20 Make sure it's easy to use for developers. make sure it's open src and well documented.=20 implement it in AES for mint (xaaes). If magic people want to use it, they supposedly have shared libs support= , so they can always port that to update their aes. (I would imagine). =20 As far as naes vs xaaes; Naes is frozen, but proven to work, so you can't blame the users to use s= omething that is useable :)=20 =20 Xaaes is definitely the future, but the transition is hard, it is best to= be persistent and always provide a safety-net, through either cross comp= atibility, or ease of switching from one to the other. (similar issues w= ith browsers on other platforms, very hard to convert people from using I= .E to firefox for example) I love the ERS look, and would love to fidget with the widgets & icons et= c, I'm an eye-candy man myself, but not if it is detrimental to what I us= e to have, That's the main reason I have never used Enlightenment Deskto= p on linux). I understand this is a desktop issue and not AES, but the d= esktop can be limited by what the AES has to offer. And in turn, the AES = can be limited by the OS and hardware. =20 I personally trust Ozk's judgement, (and Frank's as well of course). But = I believe there's a lot of miscommunication, and it would not surprise me= one bit if with a little clarification everybody would agree. Maybe tim= e to lay out a white paper about xaaes' future. =20 Was just my 2 cents, and mostly to say hi to y'all. =20 =20 Odd Skancke wrote: ons, 06,.07.2005 kl. 17.49 -0400, skrev Mark Duckworth: > On Wed, 2005-07-06 at 23:38 +0200, Zorro wrote: >=20 > > >These plugins can display a PNG *OVER* an existing image using the a= lpha > > >channel of the PNG to composite two images? > > > > > Not with the actual version ( Beta 5).. you can only choose a backgro= und=20 > > color and the RGBA will be drawn above. > >=20 > > With the next version, yes, you will can to do that. >=20 > IMHO the complaints about zview are bunk. It seems to me that it's a > good graphics conversion backend to base software on. But then again > I'm not a seasoned AES coder. What does ozk think? It should be his > choice. I'm not familiar with the libraries or whatever in question here, but I dont see no reason not to use them, as long as the API is standarized in such a way that using these libs (or whatever) dont create a problem later on (for example if they suddenly get unsupported, no source and we want to port). Best Regards Odd Skancke __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around=20 http://mail.yahoo.com=20 --0-1685815843-1120706316=:50240 Content-Type: text/html; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I've been reading quietly this whole thread.
 
It's a little confusing, and I understand the frustration of some pe= ople.
 
My take is:
find something that works well (be it zview modules, or whatever), <= /DIV>
Make sure it's easy to use for developers.
make sure it's open src and well documented.
implement it in AES for mint (xaaes).
If magic people want to use it,  they supposedly have shar= ed libs support, so they can always port that to update their aes. (I wou= ld imagine).
 
As far as naes vs xaaes;
Naes is frozen, but proven to work, so you can't blame the users to = use something that is useable :) 
 
Xaaes is definitely the future, but the transition is hard, it is be= st to be persistent and always provide a safety-net, through either cross= compatibility, or ease of switching from one to the other.  (simila= r issues with browsers on other platforms, very hard to convert people fr= om using I.E to firefox for example)
I love the ERS look, and would love to fidget with the widgets &= icons etc, I'm an eye-candy man myself, but not if it is detrimental to = what I use to have,  That's the main reason I have never used E= nlightenment Desktop on linux).  I understand this is a desktop issu= e and not AES, but the desktop can be limited by what the AES has to offe= r. And in turn, the AES can be limited by the OS and hardware.<= /DIV>
 
I personally trust Ozk's judgement, (and Frank's as well of course).= But I believe there's a lot of miscommunication, and it would not surpri= se me one bit if with a little clarification everybody would agree. = Maybe time to lay out a white paper about xaaes' future.
 
Was just my 2 cents, and mostly to say hi to y'all.
 
 
Odd Skancke <ozk@atari.org> wrote:
ons, 06,.07.2005 kl. 17.49 -0400, skrev M= ark Duckworth:
> On Wed, 2005-07-06 at 23:38 +0200, Zorro wrote:>
> > >These plugins can display a PNG *OVER* an existin= g image using the alpha
> > >channel of the PNG to composite = two images?
> > >
> > Not with the actual version ( = Beta 5).. you can only choose a background
> > color and the RG= BA will be drawn above.
> >
> > With the next version,= yes, you will can to do that.
>
> IMHO the complaints about= zview are bunk. It seems to me that it's a
> good graphics convers= ion backend to base software on. But then again
> I'm not a seasone= d AES coder. What does ozk think? It should be his
> choice.
I'm not familiar with the libraries or whatever in question here, but I<= BR>dont see no reason not to use them, as long as the API is standarized in
such a way that using these libs (or whatever) = dont create a problem
later on (for example if they suddenly get unsup= ported, no source and we
want to port).




Best Regard= s
Odd Skancke




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